- You know, Rhode Island, we don't do change well, okay?

Not at all.

Our motto is "Hope", but the subtitle should be like, "We don't do change well."

The new battery plant they wanna bring in, the pyrolysis, all of these technologies are rather new, so not everybody is very comfortable with them.

- I certainly wouldn't want something like this in my backyard, but we have to decide what it is we're gonna actually do with this type of stuff.

- [Jim] Can you imagine if this had hit an Amtrak train?

- [Barbara] It's awful!

- [Jim] I mean, it would have been national news.

- It makes people very anxious when things are falling apart on ramps.

It makes everybody nervous.

It should.

(gentle orchestral music) And welcome into this episode of "Lively."

I'm Jim Hummel.

We are joined this week by political contributor and former Libertarian of Rhode Island Chairman Billy Hunt, and former state representative Barbara Ann Fenton-Fung.

The partial collapse of a highway ramp in Cranston last weekend is a reminder of Rhode Island's decrepit infrastructure, and another potentially disastrous situation for the Rhode Island DOT.

So is it time for the department to change how it does business?

We will get to the political ramifications to this, but first, what didn't you think when you heard the news?

- Well, here we go again.

I mean, I think everybody in Rhode Island agrees that the infrastructure has been severely neglected for the past decade as the governor puts it.

But at some point that stops being an explanation and starts to become an excuse for the administration and their failures.

And the fact of the matter is Gina Raimondo, Peter Alviti, Governor McKee, all have been for the last 10 years, working on their roadworks project.

We are in the infamous 10 year plan here, and we aren't seeing any meaningful improvement.

80% of Rhode Islanders still disapprove of the infrastructure in general, and we're still continuing to see failure.

So the question is, if this has been a priority, why do we keep on seeing these failures?

And it points to, pun intended, a structural issue, a leadership issue, where it doesn't really matter if we're funding the projects or if we're outsourcing inspections or whatnot.

It is really just the fact that we're continuing to see these failures over and over again.

And nobody is really being held accountable.

You know, there's people, the inspectors, the contractors, they all got brought into the lawsuit on the Washington Bridge.

But the way those things work out, at best, we're gonna get pennies on the dollars back on any type of settlement from there.

- [Jim] And not get to the bottom of it.

- And not get to the bottom of it.

And in the end, we still have the Route 10 connector falling down.

- And you bring up a great point.

This is not anything new.

And this is falling in Dan McKee's lap.

But this goes back, it goes back way before Raimondo too.

This is 30, 40 years of neglect.

But how is McKee responding to it?

And I think what you're sensing, what we sense just when you are on talk radio and whatnot, is people are frustrated.

Like, "Oh, everything is falling down."

Well, guess what?

We made those choices, people made those choices 30, 40 years ago.

You don't get away without having consequences.

And this is where we are.

So it makes people very anxious when things are falling apart on ramps that they travel every single day.

- This was in your city.

Do you look up now whenever you are driving under an overpass?

- Especially when you come over this side, on the eastern side, yes, it makes everybody nervous.

It should.

This is not the only bridge that has a problem.

Now McKee, if he is smart, can say, "Look, I could line up an ad where you have all these governors kicking the can down the road."

And now you could say, I am working so hard on this.

I am an inconvenience to you everywhere.

There is construction everywhere, and there has been for a few years.

He has an opportunity to change this and say, "Hey, look, I am trying to fix the problem that nobody else did.

I don't think his communications staff is there, but if he wants to try to do well in this reelection, I think he has a point to be said, like, I am doing so much construction everywhere.

And yes, and almost lean into how inconvenient it is.

He has an opportunity here.

- It is.

I mean, but continuity without improvement is complacency, really.

It's not the fact that the construction is going on.

- Can we quote you on that?

- (laughing) But really because I mean, we all feel it.

I mean, we come over from the East Bay, I saw it on the way over here.

You are sitting in this traffic and you are dealing with the consequences.

But overall, you see the actual results or what is going on with the overpass.

I mean the parapet fell over and they are saying, well, we can't really tell what actually caused the damage to happen.

Then you see the inspection pictures and the pictures of the bridge itself, and it's rusting and falling apart.

It is like, well, what do you think is happening?

- And they are saying it is so obvious to everybody who looks at it, and you're like, all they had to say was, "Yes, we knew this was so bad."

By the way, this whole bridge area was scheduled to come down at the end of the year.

Like there is construction all around it.

- Can you imagine if this had hit an Amtrak train?

- It is awful.

- I mean, it would have been national news.

- Completely.

- So fortunately, but I also think the thing that has confused me, you talked about the ad and you could probably get an AI generated ad, right, with Linc Almond and Don Carcieri.

Lin Chaffey kicking the can, Bruce, going back to Edward DiPrete.

- So easy to drive.

- Why hasn't Governor McKee, he owns it now, why has he not thrown Gina Raimondo under the bus for what happened on the Washington Bridge for all of this?

Now I understand she is Commerce Secretary, maybe a couple phone calls made.

You don't hear anything about Gina Raimondo.

Why not?

- I think his comm staff, and I have criticized them a few times on this show.

They've gotta find, I know sometimes you don't like to throw shade at different members of your own party, but there is a lot of blame to be put at Raimondo's feet.

Even the Gina Jam, my husband might have been responsible for her repaving.

- He copyrighted that phrase, the Gina Jam.

- The Gina Jam.

And how she repaved over that and did that push some issues on Washington further.

- [Jim] In 2018.

- In 2018.

- They were gonna make some improvements.

- Changes and stuff like that, it happened the middle of election.

So yes, road construction is incredibly inconvenient.

It slows everybody down.

And these are the consequences of 40 years of neglect.

I think McKee needs to start pushing back.

We've talked about this before.

The governor's race is almost just not happening at this point.

It's bizarre.

They are so quiet.

He needs to start leaning into that and start throwing some people under the bus.

- Do we need it changed though?

Because when we heard Peter Alviti before that legislative committee on the Washington Bridge, it was all the inspector's fault.

You and I can look at those inspections reports.

We don't have to be engineers to figure out this is a problem.

Now I understand this is done in other parts of the state.

Do we need more internal oversight on what the inspectors are doing?

- Well, yes, I would say yes.

But again, this is an accountability thing where, the contractors bid, the inspectors inspect, the contractors bid on the job, and then when the inevitable failure happens, no one ever is held accountable for it.

I mean, Peter Alviti resigned on his own accord.

He wasn't fired because of this.

And at some point the buck needs to stop with someone who is saying, yes, we're gonna be accountable for the problems that we are having and this is our solution to fix it.

And I think Rhode Islanders are just desperate for that type of honesty and that type of person that is gonna come.

And I mean, everybody knows the infrastructure has been bad.

Everybody knows it has been neglected.

Everybody knows that this is an ongoing issue.

But we need someone that we can trust, that we can say, listen, this person, despite the political ramifications, is going to do what's right for the citizens and actually come up with a solution that is actually gonna work.

And not just a clever catchphrase like "Roadworks".

- And you absolutely hit the nail on the head.

Nobody trusts anyone over there.

And because they feel that they are always covering something, everybody thinks there's a coverup because there were so many issues with the Washington Bridge.

So, Rocchio has done a pretty good job coming out as the new- - Bob Rocchio is taking over as the interim director, yeah.

- For Peter Alviti.

And I think he, especially during the blizzard, he was trying to be that face of honesty and transparency.

Now he has got a long way to go, and we've got a lot of other things, but you're right.

No one's gonna believe that people aren't on the take or there is some kind of internal deal.

McKee has brought in a lot of outside consultants.

These people can make much more money in the private sector.

It's hard to bring that talent in on a government salary for sure.

They should try to do more of that.

But you know, when you get into the internal workings of the DOT, the guys on the inside say there are way too many out-of-state consultants and they're not knowing how different things connect here in Rhode Island and the history behind it.

- The irony is that had it not been for the Washington Bridge, now you can agree or disagree with "Roadworks".

I've never seen more construction in my life.

I didn't think we'd see the Wampanoag Trail paved in my lifetime.

Honestly.

I mean, it was like driving through Kosovo trying to get home.

Right?

And so I give hats off to Peter Alviti.

People complain about construction in the summer.

They're getting something done.

Right, and you think of all of those DOTs before him that did absolutely nothing.

So I will tip my hat, but I mean he owns the Washington Bridge.

- Yeah, I mean that's gonna be, unfortunately, his legacy.

And I don't wanna sit here and say that no work is being done.

This is something that, you know, and the construction is part of the improvement and you have to deal with the headaches of that.

But again, it is when you're dealing with the frustrations in everyday life, then all of a sudden you get a big whack, like the Washington Bridge or the Route 10 connector.

That's what really puts the- - The anxiety.

- Yes.

- Right, it's, am I driving on a safe road?

Is this bridge gonna collapse?

And also, oh my God, this is adding an hour to my commute.

- Exactly.

- So there is a lot that McKee should be out there with and being a bit more empathetic.

Gina Raimondo was a great communicator, but I think not enough stuff is getting done.

I think there is stuff going in the McKee administration, but he's not as great a communicator.

He doesn't take the bull by the horns and that could be a big downfall for him.

- Alright, keep your eyes up next time you're driving under the overpass.

All right.

Quonset Point, which has been an economic engine for the state the past two decades, is suddenly under fire as neighbors are questioning decisions by the Quonset Development Corporation that they say are having a negative effect on their quality of life.

So sludge hasn't been the word in the news recently.

This actually started, I did a story for "The Hummel Report" in the "Providence Journal" about an asphalt plant that all of a sudden showed up a mile from the neighbors.

What baffles me is QDC has been pretty good up until now, working with the neighbors.

What's happening?

- So Steven King, who runs Quonset, which is a quasi here in Rhode Island, has been doing an excellent job for the past decade, getting great big time companies to come in.

- Deep water port, all of that.

- Been hitting it out of the ballpark.

But Quonset is in between two very nice residential neighborhoods and they have to find a way to coexist.

So everything in balance, I think, you did that great story on the asphalt, that's the second asphalt plant there.

There was one and seemed to be okay.

- Todd Miozzi moved his from Coventry to North Kingstown in 2017 or 2018.

- So is there just a little bit too much going... You know, Rhode Island, we don't do change well, okay?

Not at all.

Our motto is "Hope", but the subtitle should be like, we don't do change well, and we've got that there.

But the new battery plant they wanna bring in, the pyrolysis, all of these technologies are rather new.

So not everybody is very comfortable with them.

And I think Quonset might have been moving a bit too fast or not talking to the neighbors enough and explaining that, but because your story was so on the button, that asphalt, the fumes in the air, the dust.

So now you've got headwinds from the neighbors.

Because they're like, we don't want another one of those.

And so they're gonna be very cautious and they're gonna speak out as they're doing right now.

- So maybe if sludge had been the second issue, or no, really the first issue and not the second issue, it might not have snowballed.

- It might have gone under the radar a little bit.

I think they need a little bit better branding on sludge.

That isn't the best name for what you want in your backyard.

- Bring the sludge.

- But regarding the sludge, I mean this is kind of a tough reality we're dealing with in the fact that modern environmental standards in the wastewater treatment is going to create this byproduct and we have to do something with it.

And realistically, we used to just shove this stuff right into the bay.

Which wasn't a good solution anyway.

So the great Thomas Sowell has the famous quote saying, "There are no perfect solutions.

There's only tradeoffs."

And I certainly would not want something like this in my backyard, but we have to decide what it is we're gonna actually do with this type of stuff.

And it is a new process.

It is the pyrolysis or whatever they call it that is unproven.

So there were questions about whether the permitting process was done correctly.

But this is an issue that we have in the state where, we champion economic development when there's a good outcome and then when there's a bad outcome, it becomes a pariah and a political issue.

And that's just terrible for doing business in this state because business and investment relies on consistency and things that they can count on.

And after the permitting process, when we come in and bend to political pressure and go ahead and change the rules of the game, that's going to just send the message that we're not going to be a good place to do business for anyone.

And I understand the concerns of the neighbors, you shouldn't be able to affect the quality of life if you've lived somewhere for years and then have something happen to them.

But we need to do a better job of managing those trade offs and being more transparent in the process.

And quite frankly, the neighbors need to get involved.

I see the Quonset Development Corporation was saying that a lot of people didn't show up to the public hearing for the asphalt plant and stuff like that.

So this goes back to getting more involved with your local government.

- And I think the backstory on the asphalt plant is, and it's just a mile from that nice neighborhood where a lot of people are smelling the fumes now and more so when it was hot a couple of weeks ago, is that they had the meetings and the original proposal was to have it by the water.

- Okay.

- But they couldn't do it because of the deep water port.

Now I've heard from some people, you have local representatives from the North Kingstown Council.

What was sold to them was, this is gonna happen here.

The deal that actually happened was while we're building the infrastructure, we're gonna move it inland.

That never got communicated to anybody.

So you can try to go through that process as much as you can.

I think most of us are living our lives.

I don't ask a lot for my taxes, educate my kids, pick up my garbage, if my dad's having a heart attack, whatever, come.

But we're not as engaged.

And I think that is where the trust factor was, they thought their council people were gonna be on their behalf.

And right now it looks all like, oh, Governor McKee showing up, Helena Foulkes is showing up.

It's cheap political stunts, isn't it?

- It's an election year, so this is gonna get killed on the election year here.

But you brought up that word again, trust, because something has already been changed behind their back, as they feel once, this is gonna be much more of a public fight, and whatnot, I think this will probably get punted till next year.

- A legislative study.

- [Barbara] Legislation, where things go to die.

- You know about that, right?

- [Barbara] Yes.

- [Jim] That's on the sludge.

- The sludge.

- But they wanna put in a battery plant, a battery storage plant.

So then everybody thinks about the Tesla catching on fire.

- Around there, and this is all coming to a head too, because Woonsocket's sludge incinerator is coming offline.

They have fought that for years.

That is beyond repair.

- We can't just truck it into Bellingham and dump it?

Oxbridge?

- Away from the state.

So this will be an issue.

Unfortunately we're gonna be talking a lot about sludge over the next year.

It's not pretty, but this is sometimes the things that end up in elective officials' laps.

But again, Quonset and Steven King, they should do a little bit more on the communication side and try to get this to a better place.

Otherwise everything that comes in is gonna be facing much more opposition.

- Well, the battery plant, there is a great point as well.

I mean that is a result of the environmental policies that we have right here.

So you can't have one without the other.

We want to have a better bay, cleaner air, all this other stuff like that.

We need to have the trade off and do something with the way that infrastructure actually functions so it's something we have to consider.

- Okay, let's shift gears a little bit.

Bally's, the old Twin River, people call it by what it was like 15- - Yes.

It's still Twin River.

- Narragansett Electric.

Twin River.

They are telling the legislature because, hey, you passed the smoking ban, which by the way, they passed it last year, and those gutless lawmakers said, oh, we'll wait until 2027, while everybody breathes in the smoke, the workers.

Can you tell I'm worked up about this?

They say, well look, we're gonna lose a lot of business because the smokers aren't gonna come.

We need more money from the state.

- If you were sitting in the chamber right now- - You would say stop.

So basically Mohegan, Foxwoods, Plainridge, Encore and everything, you can't smoke on the floors.

And obviously this has been a long time coming at Bally's at Twin River and your competitive advantage shouldn't be smoking.

Okay, we're in 2026 and that's where we are.

- And let's be clear, it was Dominic Ruggerio for all those years.

- For all those years, he kept it.

- Rest in peace.

But he was the- - He stopped that every single year.

So now that it has gone through, and like you said, they've punted it to 2027, I think it would be upon Bally's to say, hey look, we need to innovate and find some other kind of competitive advantage besides just smoking.

And I would encourage them to go back and say, hey, look.

They already have a ton of money from the state in advertising and whatnot, and they don't use it all every year is what I've been understanding from the recent news- - You don't think the campaign should be "Come Smoke Here?"

- Come smoke here, come smoke outside.

I don't know.

Let's see what else we can do to make it, and I think that involves adding a bit more in that area.

There is a lot of parking room in that complex.

You could absolutely build a bit more of an entertainment area, renovate it.

And I think that would be the much wiser investment for the state to be helping them make instead of giving them more advertising dollars right now.

- I mean the idea that Bally's had a carve out from the indoor smoking ban in general is kind of ludicrous.

I mean, this is the sin tax, the vice where we're counting on social harms to fund our state government.

And this is not a way to run a railroad here.

The Bally's spokeswoman mentioned in the article that there is an affordability problem and there are uncertain economic times.

So we need this additional revenue to help with our marketing to make sure people come gamble.

Well, the people who are coming to gamble or spend their money on smoking, that's an affordability issue.

And to be using taxpayer money to fund a problem, to exacerbate the social ills that we have here is is not a good strategy.

And it's the system itself where the state is funding the casino, which is then in turn funding the state.

And that's just not economic development.

We are socializing the risk and socializing the externalities that come from it and privatizing the profits.

And we do that a lot here in Rhode Island.

It goes back to 38 Studios, the soccer stadium, the Providence Place Mall.

- We'll do a separate show afterwards.

We'll go through the ills of Rhode Island.

You know the history on this, when Lincoln Almond and Don Carcieri were governors, Republicans, they said, we're not gonna do casinos, we're not gonna have gambling.

But they had their hands out for the slot money, didn't they?

- Correct.

- When it came to balancing the budget.

I was interested, I was filling in on talk radio on WPRO Monday morning, and I said, I equated it to, you know, when everybody said, "Oh, if we eliminate smoking in the restaurants, everybody's gonna leave."

Well it brought in in Dunkin', a whole pile of people who didn't want to have to go through the haze to get their latte.

It brought them back.

But one guy called me, he said it was interesting, he said, "If I can't smoke, I go to Twin River because I can smoke.

If I can't smoke..." I say, "Well, you can't smoke anywhere else."

He said, "But Mohegan and Foxwoods are nicer casinos.

So I would rather go, if I can't smoke, I would rather go to a place that has better amenities."

So it goes to your point, maybe you make your casino a little bit more desirable.

- I mean, I was at Mohegan Sun last month with my mom, it's beautiful.

They are walking around there, all the restaurants and entertainment.

We need more of that at Bally's to make it much more competitive in the long run.

Short term fixes, especially we know this all the time, get us through the next election cycle, but they're not gonna keep that casino.

And we are, we have to admit Rhode Island is heavily reliant on this gambling.

And now with Sportsbook and online betting and whatnot, it creates a whole different thing.

So I think they need to just make their product better and that might be a, I think more legislators would be like, hey, let's help them make that investment.

- Let's shift gears.

Last topic before we get to outrageous.

And kudos to the national.

Now Billy of course, there's always a connection.

After the White House, after the correspondence dinner shooting, Billy says, "Hey, you know, I was at that hotel listening to Trump."

I'm like, ding ding ding ding.

So set the table, the Libertarians were meeting.

- We had the 2024 Libertarian National Convention was at the Hilton in Washington, DC.

- You were courting President Trump, or was he courting you?

- He was courting us.

He was trying to build his coalition and was trying to court the Libertarian vote.

And in his typical style was claiming that he might actually get the Libertarian endorsement, which was a tall tale.

But we went through the security process to hear him speak.

It wasn't, we had our convention in the main ballroom, but he was speaking in a separate room.

So we went through the Secret Service and I gotta say, the Libertarian crowd was very openly hostile to Trump.

We aren't huge Trump supporters in general.

But Libertarians in general, we operate on the non-aggression principle where we don't believe in the use of force to gain political advantage or to push our political agenda.

So even though we had a- - But heckling is okay.

- Well heckling is fine.

- Not force.

- And that's the thing is that I think the problem that we have in general with the political culture right now is that we are dehumanizing people.

And we're making it so that, it's fine to disagree with someone.

You can have a difference of opinion, you can yell and scream at them.

But we're getting to a point where the hyperbole and the rhetoric that's coming out is creating an environment where deranged people are gonna do crazy things.

So I think the culture in general needs to do a better job of making their points while empathizing with the other side and being able to understand where they're coming from.

Because if the President of the United States is having this much of effect on your day-to-day life, there is something, that's a larger problem with our government.

- But it's the toothpaste out of the tube.

Can we put it back in?

- So it's incumbent on elected officials and community leaders to help put it back.

That night, as the shooting was going on, we had friends in that ballroom and people are like, this is a sick country.

Well, it's about time to stop blaming each other.

And you heard it the next day.

"Well it was the Democrats."

Both parties are doing it.

Knock it off.

And just because you can say something and I understand, First Amendment right, I can say whatever I want.

Sure you can, but should you?

And I think it is time that there's people, you know, Obama does a really good job with this sometimes too.

President Obama will always kind of elevate the conversation and take it a step up.

And I think these are the type of things that we wanna see.

I go back to the Jimmy Kimmel this past week, and his remark about, "You're an expectant widow," and whatnot.

Yes, you can say that, but should you have?

Or could you have said something better?

Can we stop it with those jokes and can we raise the bar?

And I think that is where we need to go as elected officials.

Look, I've been on the other side of when we needed to get no trespassing orders against certain people.

And we've had to deal with some really bizarre threats in our time in public life.

That is, I know it's part of it, but it can't become a larger part of it.

And it should be incredibly rare instead of the daily- - But it doesn't help when you have somebody occupying the Oval Office who doesn't wanna raise the bar.

- [Barbara] He doesn't.

- I mean, he immediately went and you saw this at Butler, Pennsylvania and the other assassination attempt.

It's immediately let's all come together and then that dissolves after 24 hours.

- I don't know what the answer is.

I go back to the same thing we were talking about with the sludge facility.

I think people need to focus more on their- - It all comes back to sludge.

- It all comes back to sludge.

We need to focus on our local issues.

Again, if you get more involved with the actual politics that can change your everyday life and make an effect change where you're actually gonna experience that change in your local community, I think people are gonna be a lot more better off mentally and healthy.

If you use all that effort yelling and screaming and standing on overpasses screaming about Trump, and go show up to a town council meeting or a Quonset Development meeting.

I was just at the budget hearings for my town and there was nobody there except for the department heads of the town.

So I think it is something that change that focus and channel that energy into something more productive.

- Well, and it's also no surprise why so many people are leaving Congress.

What is Congress getting done?

And then look, I think it is pretty clear that the House and potentially the Senate's gonna flip.

And then Trump's gonna be totally neutered for the last two years.

So then where are we, we gotta go into another cycle.

But this has been happening the last several cycles.

What is Congress actually doing for us?

- And nobody, I mean as someone who's in elected life and we went down that path, not much.

And that's the frustration.

And so not only are certain congresspeople being like, "I'm done."

It is also too, it's hard to get any good guys to run.

- [Jim] Why would you wanna run?

- Why would you wanna put your family in front of those threats?

And now with the whole Savannah Guthrie and her mother, you have to worry about your parents during those.

- Why would you wanna be mayor of Cranston?

- (laughing) Well that is a whole different thing.

- All right, we'll do another show.

Let's go to outrageous and, or kudos.

- William, let's begin with you this week.

- Yeah, so I guess it is kind of the theme of what we've been talking about where success in the state has a million parents and failure has orphans.

And I think we need to do- - He is full of, I'm gonna go back and use all of these.

You are rocking it today.

- Well we're, again, we're very good at celebrating intentions.

This is Rhode Island.

Everything is an idea.

It's a good idea that everybody talks about how great things are gonna work out.

And nobody goes back and actually checks on the outcomes and sees what the results of the plan are.

I mean, "Roadworks" is a good example.

We're 10 years into it and we have another bridge falling down here in the state.

So I think just the fact that we have a bunch of people that are running the state who seem to be in it for all the political reasons, not the reasons to actually help the citizens and make improvements in the state.

And it goes back to just again, the accountability and the blame and the shifting the responsibility to the past administrations and everything like that.

I think Rhode Islanders think it is time that we actually have a leader who is actually gonna forge a path forward, and be resilient and know what it is that they actually want to get their message across.

And be damned to the political pressures that are pushing them everywhere.

They're not gonna skip a meeting to go meet the King of England to go sit at a North Kingstown- - Sludge.

- I'm sorry.

- I was ready for you to announce you're running for governor after that speech.

- So yeah, his wife would kill him.

What do you have?

- Alright, well my kudos is kind of going in the opposite direction, and I'm talking about King Charles.

So kudos.

I used to live in the UK, I'm a big fan.

- [Jim] I didn't know that.

- I know, all these funny things I did in my 20s, but I thought King Charles put on a masterclass when it came to diplomacy over the past few days here for a state visit.

Any time a world leader comes to visit President Trump, that is a hold your breath moment.

And let's see if we can get out of this without a complete international incident.

I thought he did a wonderful job.

I am a big fan of him and his son, Prince William's Earthshot.

I think they're using their platform for bigger good.

So I thought he did a masterclass in how to handle Trump.

And I think it was very fitting that we had fun with the King before we celebrate our 250th anniversary this summer.

So it was a nice little pre-celebration.

- You love listening to the accent.

- All the time.

- And the dry humor.

- After the show, you're gonna gimme your best British accent.

But after the show.

- Oh, yeah, I know, let's not put that on Google.

- Barbara Ann and Billy, thank you.

That was an entertaining half hour and thank you for joining us.

Be sure and check us out on Facebook, X, Instagram, and on the Ocean State Media YouTube channel.

We'll see you next time right here on "Lively."

(gentle orchestral music) - [Announcer] "Lively" is generously supported in part by John Hazen White's "Lookout."