JIM: THIS WEEK ON "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT," THE SCHEDULE IS SET FOR THE FIRST CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT HAS THE FLOODGATES OPEN FOR CANDIDATES ANNOUNCING A RUN.

AND FINANCIAL UNCERTAINTY CONTINUES TO SURROUND THE BUCKET SOCCER STADIUM PROJECT AS GOVERNOR MCKEE TRIES TO REASSURE SKEPTICS.

>> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> FOR OVER 30 YEARS, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT," HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF THE POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I'’M A PROUD SUPPORTER OF THIS GREAT PROGRAM AND RHODE ISLAND PBS.

JIM: JOINING US ON THIS WEEK'’S PANEL, FORMER STATE REPRESENTATIVE MIKE MARCELLO, ATTORNEY AND LEGAL ANALYST LOU PULNER, AND FORMER RHODE ISLAND ATTORNEY GENERAL ARLENE VIOLET.

WE WILL HAVE MORE ON THE INDICTMENT OF DONALD TRUMP MOMENTARILY.

FIRST, THE RHODE ISLAND SECRETARY OF STATE ANNOUNCING THIS WEEK THAT THE PRIMARY FOR CD1 WILL BE RIGHT AFTER LABOR DAY AND THE GENERAL ON NOVEMBER 7, LARGELY MIRRORING LAST YEAR'’S ELECTION CYCLE.

THIS AS 10 CANDIDATES AS OF THIS TAPING SAYS THEY WILL RUN TO TRY AND REPLACE DAVID CICILLINE IN WASHINGTON.

MIKE, LET ME BEGIN WITH YOU.

I DON'’T KNOW IF WE SHOULD GET A POOL GOING ON WHAT THAT NUMBER SHOULD BE BUT IT WILL BE GROWING.

MIKE: THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE LOOKING, I KNOW THE MAYOR INDICATED SHE MIGHT BE LOOKING INTO IT.

THE MAYOR OF EAST PROVIDENCE IS LOOKING INTO IT SERIOUSLY.

I THINK IT WILL GROW.

IT IS LIKE A NO RISK SITUATION.

PEOPLE IN OFFICE RIGHT NOW CAN PUT THEIR NAME IN, COLLECT 500 SIGNATURES, GROW THEIR NAME RECOGNITION.

IT IS VERY TEMPTING TO A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT CURRENTLY HOLD SEATS.

JIM: YOU COULD GET OUT FOR UNDER A MILLION.

MIKE: TECHNICALLY ALL YOU NEED IS 500 SIGNATURES TO GET ON THE PRIMARY.

CD1 IS MORE LIBERAL THAN CD2.

I THINK IT WILL BE A MIX OF CANDIDATES THAT WILL JOIN IN.

PROVIDENCE IS WHERE A LOT OF THE VOTES ARE, PAWTUCKET.

RUMOR IS THAT HE IS SERIOUSLY THINKING ABOUT IT, SO THAT IS ALMOST LIKE A FREE RIDE.

IF YOU LOSE, YOU BUILD YOUR NAME RECOGNITION, BUILD YOUR FUNDRAISING LIST.

IF YOU WIN, YOU GO TO CONGRESS.

JIM: IT IS SUCH A SHORT TIME, NAME RECOGNITION IS KEY.

ARLENE, YOU HAVE MUCH GREATER NAME RECOGNITION THAT A LOT OF THESE PEOPLE.

ANY CHANCE ARLENE VIOLET WILL RUN?

ARLENE: I CERTAINLY DON'’T WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE CANDIDATES WHO ARE RUNNING BECAUSE IT IS A POTENTIAL CONFLICT OF INTEREST FOR ME TO DO THAT, IT WOULD BE UNFAIR.

BUT I HAVE BEEN ASKED I PEOPLE WHO I RESPECT YOU CONSIDER IT.

WITHOUT QUESTION, WE HAVE A GLEEFUL BIGOTRY IN THIS COUNTRY, WHERE CITIZENS ARE TURNED AGAINST THE CITIZEN.

REGRETTABLY, FAR TOO MANY MEMBERS OF CONGRESS FAN THAT DESPICABLE PITTING OF ONE PERSON AGAINST THE OTHER BECAUSE ALL THEY WANT TO DO IS GET REELECTED, AND THE HECK WITH THE CONSTITUTION AND THE VALUES THAT THIS COUNTRY STANDS FOR.

WHAT IS ATTRACTIVE FOR ME TO CONSIDER RUNNING IS BECAUSE I WOULD LIKE TO CALL THEM OUT ON THAT.

I THINK I WOULD HAVE THAT KIND OF FORM.

ON THE OTHER HAND, I HAVE RESPONSIBILITIES AND COMMITMENTS THAT I HAVE TO SERIOUSLY WEIGH.

WHEN I LOOK AT THOSE COMMITMENTS, IT REMINDS ME, MY FIRST JOB WAS TO CLERK FOR A SENIOR JUSTICE AT THE RHODE ISLAND SUPREME COURT.

THE WONDERFUL ATTORNEY GENERAL SO THAT I WILL GIVE YOU THE CONSUMER THAT JOB IF YOU COME IN JANUARY.

I SAID, NO, I HAVE A COMMITMENT UNTIL MAY.

I COULD NOT DO IT THEN BECAUSE THE SISTERS OF MERCY ADAGE WAS THAT YOU HAD TO BE FAITHFUL TO THE LITTLE THINGS THAT YOU PROMISE, NOT JUST THE BIG THINGS.

JIM: BUT YOU HAVE BEEN APPROACHED ON THE REPUBLICAN SIDE?

ARLENE: APPROACHED BY PEOPLE THAT ARE DEMOCRAT, REPUBLICAN, AND INDEPENDENT.

IF I WOULD DO IT, I WOULD BE DOING IT AS AN INDEPENDENT.

JIM: YOU ARE GIVING IT SERIOUS CONSIDERATION?

ARLENE: I AM GIVING IT SERIOUS CONSIDERATION BECAUSE OF MY RESPECT FOR PEOPLE, CONSTERNATION WITH HOW THIS COUNTRY HAS BECOME WITH CITIZENS REALLY HATING OTHER CITIZENS, THE LACK OF CIVIL RIGHTS THAT CONTINUE FOR PEOPLE UNABATED IN THIS COUNTRY.

I THINK I WOULD HAVE A FORUM BECAUSE OF MY BACKGROUND TO ADDRESS THOSE ISSUES.

CONGRESS IS BEHIND A LOT OF THE FESTERING HATRED THAT OCCURS IN THIS COUNTRY BECAUSE THEY WANT TO BE REELECTED.

I ALSO HAVE TO LOOK AT WHETHER THE LOU PULNER'’S OF THE WORLD, WHO I WAS SMART ENOUGH TO HIRE, AND THIS GENTLEMAN WHO I CONSIDER A DEMOCRAT HERO IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, IF I COULD GET PEOPLE TO SAY, FOR 15 MONTHS, WE ARE GOING TO JOIN THIS MOVEMENT AND ADDRESS WHAT THIS COUNTRY OUGHT TO BE.

JIM: WHEN DO YOU THINK YOU'’LL MAKE A DECISION?

ARLENE: I AM TAKING COUNSEL AMONG PEOPLE, THERE ARE DEADLINES THAT HE STARTED THE SHOW WITH, BUT I JUST WANTED TO TAKE MY TIME.

WEIGHING HEAVILY AGAINST A RUN IS PERSONAL COMMITMENTS.

I HAVE TO MAKE SURE I CAN FULFILL.

JIM: MONEY IS ALWAYS AN ISSUE, BUT NAME RECOGNITION.

LET ME ASK LOU ABOUT NAME RECOGNITION WITH ARLENE.

LOU: EVERYONE KNOWS WHO ARLENE VIOLET IS.

SERIOUSLY, THE FIRST FEMALE ATTORNEY GENERAL.

YOU BUILT A CAREER ON JUST SUCH GREAT CHARACTER.

I THINK SHE WOULD BE A GREAT CANDIDATE.

TO YOUR POINT, I WOKE UP YESTERDAY AFTER THE INDICTMENT WAS ANNOUNCED AND I SAID I DON'’T RECOGNIZE THIS COUNTRY ANYMORE.

THAT IS WHAT YOU WERE SAYING.

JIM: LET'’S TALK ABOUT THAT.

LATE THURSDAY NIGHT, WE ARE TAPING FRIDAY MORNING, DONALD TRUMP WAS INDICTED IN MANHATTAN.

ARLENE, LET'’S BEGIN WITH YOU.

I DIDN'’T PLAN THIS.

[LAUGHTER] WE HAVE THREE LAWYERS HERE.

LET ME BEGIN WITH YOU, BECAUSE I THE TIME YOU WATCH THIS, WE MAY KNOW WHAT THE CHARGES ARE, WE HAVE A FEELING OF WHAT THEY ARE.

HOW DO YOU FEEL AT FIRST BLUSH OF HIM GETTING INDICTED?

ARLENE: IT IS ALWAYS WRONG TO DISCUSS WHEN YOU DON'’T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE INDICTMENTS ARE.

AS YOU KNOW, THEY ARE ALL MISDEMEANORS IF IT JUST PERTAINS TO HUSH MONEY, BUT TO THE DEGREE THEY ARE LINKED WITH CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS, THAT BUMPS THEM UP TO A FELONY STATUS.

I DON'’T WANT TO COMMENT ABOUT THAT, BUT I WILL SAY SOMETHING ABOUT TIMING.

THERE ARE THREE MORE SERIOUS INVESTIGATIONS GOING ON THAT I THINK PEOPLE WOULD IDENTIFY MORE WITH.

I THINK WE WILL HAVE AN ATTITUDE ABOVE THIS BLUSH OF INDICTMENTS, SIMLAR TO THE OLD DAYS WHEN MOB GUYS WERE INDICTED.

THEY WERE INDICTED BECAUSE THEY DIDN'’T PAY TAXES.

I REMEMBER PEOPLE DISCUSSING BACK THEN, THEY WOULD WHACK A GUY HERE AND THERE, THEY DON'’T GET THEM FOR THAT, BUT THEY GET THEM ON TAXES.

WHAT IS THAT ABOUT?

I THINK THAT WILL BE THE REACTION TO THE TIMING OF THIS.

IT IS THE LEAST OF ALL OF THE ABOVE.

JIM: YOU HAVE GEORGIA, THE DOCUMENTS, JANUARY 6.

IF YOU HAD ONE PROSECUTOR -- I DON'’T HAVE TO TELL YOU, YOU HAVE BEEN IN THE LEGAL WORLD.

ONE PROSECUTOR OVERLOOKING THE ENTIRE SITUATION, YOU WOULD START WITH YOUR WEAKEST CASE.

NEW YORK ALMOST LOOKS LIKE THE WEAKEST.

OF THOSE THAT THEY ARE LOOKING AT, WHICH IS THE STRONGEST?

>> I THINK THE GEORGIA ELECTION THING.

YOU HAVE IT ON TAPE, THE CALLS ARE WELL DOCUMENTED.

HE MAY BE INDEBTED TO NEW YORK, BUT THAT CASE MAY BE MORE READY TO GO TO TRIAL.

TIMING WILL BE AN ISSUE.

AS AMERICANS, WE HAVE TO PAUSE A LITTLE BIT AND SAY, CERTAINLY HISTORIC, A SAD MOMENT IN AMERICAN HISTORY THAT A FORMER PRESIDENT IS INDICTED, BUT LET'’S LET THE PROCESS PLAY OUT.

HE WILL HAVE A TRIAL BEFORE A JURY OF HIS PEERS, PRESUMED INNOCENT.

HAVE FAITH IN THE JURY SYSTEM.

LET'’S SEE WHERE IT GOES.

LOU: THEY ARE SAYING THERE COULD BE AS MANY AS 30 COUNTS JUST IN NEW YORK.

THE REALITY IS, THE HUSH MONEY WAS PAID IN 2017.

IT IS 2023.

THERE IS A SIX-YEAR STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS.

JIM: DO YOU THINK THAT IS WHAT IS DRIVING THIS?

LOU: IF HE WAS HELL-BENT ON BRINGING AN INDICTMENT, HE WAS UNDER A TIME CONSTRAINT.

I AGREE, JUST BECAUSE THEY WERE THE FIRST TO INDICT DOESN'’T MEAN THAT THEY ARE THE FIRST TO GO TO TRIAL.

THE GEORGIA CASE COULD, COULD BE THE DOCUMENTS.

I THINK IT WILL BE EITHER THE GEORGIA CASE OR JANUARY 6.

JIM: THE TIMING, THE WHEELS OF JUSTICE DON'’T ALWAYS MOVE AS QUICKLY AS WE WOULD LIKE.

THIS IS PUSHING INTO THE ELECTION CYCLE.

EVEN IN NEW YORK, WOULDN'’T THEY BE READY FOR TRIAL THIS YEAR?

ARLENE: THEY COULD POTENTIALLY.

I AM SURE THAT WOULD BE A DECISION THAT TRUMP'’S LAWYERS WOULD MAKE, WHETHER THEY WAT TO GO TO TRIAL.

THEY DON'’T KNOW THE ANSWER BECAUSE THEY DON'’T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE EVIDENCE IS.

WHEN YOU ARE CHARGED, YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO THE GRAND JURY TRANSCRIPTS AND PROCEEDINGS.

THEY WILL DECIDE IF THEY WANT TO RUSH IT TO TRIAL BECAUSE IT IS SO WEAK, OR IF IT LOOKS STRONG, THEY WILL DELAY.

MIKE: ONE THING IT HAS DONE IS RATCHETING UP THE FUNDRAISING.

TRUMP IS SAYING, GIVE ME MONEY, DONATE TO MY CAMPAIGN.

JIM: I THINK IT DEPENDS ON WHAT ELSE HAPPENS IN THE OTHER CASES, BUT IN SHORT, HE IS USING THIS TO HIS POLITICAL ADVANTAGE.

IF HE IS INDICTED IN GEORGIA AND THE OTHER CASES, THAT IS PROBLEMATIC.

LOU: IT IS.

HE HAD A GOOD RUN BUT HE IS NOT THE CLEANEST GUY WE HAVE EVER SEEN IN POLITICS, THE THINGS THAT HE SAYS, THE THINGS THAT HE HAVE DONE.

HIS BUSINESS JUST GOT CONVICTED.

HIS ACCOUNTANT WENT TO JAIL.

AT SOME POINT, BECAUSE OF LEGAL EXPENSES ALONE, HE IS GOING TO DRY UP ON THE FUNDRAISING.

WHAT SURPRISES ME IS HE HAS NOW JUMPED HIGHER IN THE RATINGS AGAINST DESANTIS, WHICH I DON'’T UNDERSTAND.

JIM: POLITICALLY, WHAT DO YOU THINK?

ARLENE: I THINK IT HELPS HIM IN THE SHORT RUN, BUT PEOPLE WILL GET VERY WEARY OF HIM, ENOUGH ALREADY.

IF IT IS CUMULATIVE, IT WILL HURT HIM POLITICALLY.

I WANT TO SAY ONE THING, EVEN IF IT IS POLITICAL, WHO BUT PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF YOU BRING OUT YOUR PROBLEMS AND ERRORS ARE.

WHEN YOU ARE RUNNING, OF COURSE.

THAT IS THE ONLY PERSON THAT HAS STUDIED YOU TO TAKE YOU DOWN A PEG OR TWO.

YES, IT IS CRITICAL.

WHEN DENNY ROBBINS CRITICIZED ME, IT WAS CRITICAL, BUT HE HAD THE INTEREST TO DEFEAT ME.

THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BAD GUY.

IT COULD HAVE BEEN TRUE.

JIM: AND THAT WILL SHAKE OUT WITH THE VOTERS.

LAST QUESTION FOR YOU.

TRUMP WILL MAKE A LOT OF THIS, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE SAID THAT PREVIOUS PROSECUTORS PASSED ON THIS CASE.

DOES THAT TROUBLE YOU AT ALL?

DOES EVERY PROSECUTOR TAKE A FRESH LOOK?

ARLENE: EVERY PROSECUTOR TAKES A FRESH LOOK.

THEY DO WEIGH THE POLITICAL FACTORS.

FOR OTHER PEOPLE IT IS LESS OF A POINT OF POLITICS.

THEY THINK THAT WHAT IS, IS, AND THAT IS WHAT WE ARE GOING TO DO.

LOU: HE ACTUALLY SAID IN HIS CAMPAIGN, I AM GOING TO DO THIS.

THAT IS WHER IT BECOMES POLITICAL.

MIKE: YOU HAVE THE JURORS WHO WILL ULTIMATELY DECIDE WHETHER HE CROSSED THE LINE.

THAT IS WHY WE ALL HAVE TO COME DOWN.

-- CALM DOWN.

LOU: EVERYONE TALKS ABOUT STORMY DANIELS, BUT THERE WAS ANOTHER WOMAN, KAREN MCDOUGAL, AND THAT WAS WHERE DAVID BECKER, THE HEAD OF THE NATIONAL ENQUIRER, HE HAS TESTIFIED TWICE BEFORE THE GRAND JURY FOR WHAT THEY CALL CATCH AND KILL.

HE PAID HER FOR THE STORY AND THEN KILLED THE STORY AS A FAVOR TO TRUMP.

THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS HERE THAT ARE SMELLY.

ARLENE: MR. TRUMP'’S EXPLANATION WILL BE I NEVER HAD AN AFFAIR WITH THOSE WOMEN, I PAID MONEY BECAUSE IT WAS GOING TO HURT MY CAMPAIGN.

BUT I DIDN'’T DO IT.

JIM:LOU: EXCEPT THE TIMING OF THE PAYMENTS WERE JUST BEFORE THE ELECTION.

JIM: THAT WILL ALL BE LAID OUT IN COURT.

LAST WEEK, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE PAWTUCKET SOCCER STADIUM, PUTTING A POSITIVE IT'’S PORTION OF THE FUNDING.

RISING INTEREST RATES AND OTHER THINGS GOING ON.

LOU, GOVERNOR MCKEE IS FLYING THE FLAG, SAYING THINGS ARE GOING FORWARD.

DON GREBIEN SEEMS CONFIDENT.

ARE YOU CONFIDENT?

LOU: GOVERNOR MCKEE HAS SAID THAT HE WILL BE IN TOUCH WITH JEROME POWELL, THE FED CHAIRMAN, TO TELL HIM TO EASE UP ON RAISING THESE RATES SO WE CAN GET THINGS DONE HERE.

JIM: DO YOU THINK YOU WILL TAKE THAT CALL FROM THE GOVERNOR OF RHODE ISLAND?

LOU: NOT A CHANCE.

IT WAS A COMMITMENT.

THE GOVERNOR WENT DOWN THERE AND MADE THE DECIDING VOTE TO GET THIS THING PASSED.

HE WAS CLOSE WITH GREBIEN, WANTED TO HELP HIM.

WHETHER IT IS THE TOWER, THE SUPERMAN BUILDING, TIDEWATER LANDING, THE SOCCER STADIUM, I DON'’T SEE ANY OF THOSE PROJECTS -- JIM: HIGH SCHOOLS IN WARWICK, PROJECT.

FORTUNATELY, EAST PROVIDENCE GOT THEIR BUILDINGS.

MIKE IS A SOLICITOR THERE.

MIKE: IT IS HAVING AN EFFECT ON THE ECONOMY.

THAT IS A BIG LOSS FOR PAWTUCKET IF THEY CANNOT GET THAT BUILT.

THE SUPERMAN BUILDING, THE NATIONAL ECONOMY HAS IN EFFECT, EVEN IN RHODE ISLAND.

THE PLANS WERE THERE.

IF WE DON'’T HAVE PRIVATE INVESTORS, IT WILL NOT HAPPEN.

ARLENE: OF COURSE, BLAMING POWELL FOR THIS IS LIKE A MISDIRECTION, A HOCUS-POCUS PLAY.

THIS WAS NOT THE BRIGHTEST IDEA TO HAVE THIS STADIUM.

17 GAMES OR SO, AND THEN IT IS EMPTY THE REST OF THE TIME.

JUST LIKE WITH THE PAWSOX THING.

WE ARE GOING TO HAVE ALL OF THESE CONCERTS.

I JUST THINK IT IS A TOTAL MISDIRECTION.

A LITTLE BIT ARROGANT TO SAY, I WILL DICTATE TO THE FED CHAIR THAT HE IS DOING SOMETHING WRONG.

CLEARLY, THERE IS AN ELEMENT, INTEREST RATES, BUT CERTAINLY, DEMOCRATS HAVE OVERSPENT MONEY.

THEY HAVE THROWN COVID MONEY OUT THERE THAT THEY DON'’T EVEN KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH.

DEMOCRAT'’S POLICIES HAVE ALSO CONTRIBUTED TO THE STATE OF THINGS NOW.

JIM: GOVERNOR MCKEE WILL DO IT UNTIL THE LAST DAY, UNTIL BIDEN CALLS IT OFF IN MAY, BECAUSE WE BENEFIT FINANCIALLY.

ARLENE: WE DON'’T EVEN KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH THE MONEY.

JIM: I HEARD GOVERNOR MCKEE SAY THEY HAD APPROVAL FOR THIS YEAR AGO, INTEREST RATES JUST STARTED GOING UP.

THEY SHOULD HAVE HAD THEIR DUCKS IN AN ORDER.

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT ARGUMENT?

COULD HAVE GOTTEN FINANCING BEFORE THE INTEREST RATES WENT UP.

LOU: WHY DO YOU THINK THEY WERE SO SCARED OF BANKS FAILING?

THEY BOUGHT LOIC, EVERYTHING IS HIGH NOW, AND EVERYTHING IS UNDERWATER.

YOU SIT ON YOUR HANDS AND THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.

I THOUGHT THIS STADIUM HAD A BIG L ON IT FROM THE BEGINNING.

17 GAMES.

PAWTUCKET?

NO.

JIM: WHAT DO YOU THINK WILL HAPPEN?

MIKE: THE FEAR FROM THE POLITICAL PERSPECTIVE IS THEY WILL ASK THE STATE FOR MORE MONEY.

THAT WILL BE HARD TO GET FROM THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

JIM: HE HAS MONEY IN THE GROUND RIGHT NOW.

THEY ALWAYS SAY IT IS HARD TO WALK AWAY FROM.

MIKE: IT WILL PROBABLY HAVE TO GET SCALED IN SOME FASHION BUT IT HAS TO BE COMPLETED.

OTHERWISE, YOU ARE LOOKING AT A BIG HOLE NEAR THE BLACKSTONE RIVER.

ARLENE: I DON'’T THINK THE STATE WILL GIVE THEM THE MONEY.

IF REAL INVESTORS WILL NOT INVEST, WHAT IS THE STATE DOING INVESTING IN A PROJECT THAT OTHER INVESTORS, WHO HAVE TO USE THEIR MONEY, SAY THIS IS NOT A GOOD IDEA?

THIS IS A RIPOFF OF THE TAXPAYERS.

JIM: FOR YEARS, LEGISLATION HAS BEEN FILED AT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY TO ROLLBACK THE SO-CALLED PAYDAY LENDING, ALLOWING SOME LENDERS TO CHARGE UP TO 260% IN INTEREST.

MIKE, YOU SAT IN THE CHAMBER FOR MANY YEARS.

HOW MANY YEARS DID THEY PROPOSE -- MIKE: I SERVED IN 2008 THROUGH 2016 AND EVERY YEAR THE BILL WAS THERE.

JIM: WHAT MAKES THE DIFFERENCE NOW IS, SOME LEGISLATORS HAVE SAID BRING IT TO THE FLOOR.

MIKE: IT NEVER GOT OUT OF THE COMMITTEE.

SIGNING THE LETTER IS ONE THING.

GREAT.

ASKING TO HAVE THE PETITION DISCHARGED IS ANOTHER THING.

THE RULES ALSO ALLOW 38 MEMBERS TO DISCHARGE THE BILL FROM COMMITTEE TO FORCE IT TO THE FLOOR.

I AM WAITING FOR THAT.

THAT IS WHERE THE REAL POWER LIES.

IF 38 OF THOSE 50 ARE WILLING TO SIGN THE DISCHARGE PETITION, THAT PUTS YOU IN THE CROSSHAIRS OF THE SPEAKER.

JIM: AND YOU HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT YOUR OTHER LEGISLATION.

LOU: I GIVE A LOT OF CREDIT TO JOHN LOMBARDI.

HE HAS SHEPHERDED THE 50 OR MORE OF THE LEGISLATORS IN THE HOUSE TO SIGN ON TO THIS BILL.

AND HE IS RIGHT.

IT DOES HURT THE DISENFRANCHISED THE MOST, PEOPLE ON FIXED INCOMES, MINORITIES, PEOPLE IN POOR NEIGHBORHOODS.

IT IS TIME.

MIKE: ONE OF THE THINGS THAT IS INTERESTING, PEOPLE TALK ABOUT THE INTEREST AND THE LOBBIES, BUT THERE IS ALSO A REALISTIC COMPONENT.

A LOT OF THESE ARE IN STOREFRONTS.

LANDLORDS HAD A LOBBY.

WHERE THEY RENT.

LOU: AND THEY WOULD GET PAID IN CASH.

JIM: WHAT A SURPRISE.

PROBABLY NOT COINCIDENTAL THAT THE CHIEF LOBBYIST IS THE FORMER SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE.

ARLENE: THE NUMBER ONE BLOT DEMOCRATS IN PARTICULAR IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY IS THIS PAYDAY LOAN FIASCO.

TO ALLOW THAT MUCH INTEREST TO BE PAID TO PEOPLE THAT LEND THEM MONEY, WHEN THEY ARE IN A TERRIBLE SITUATION, WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN SOMEBODY WANTS PAYDAY LENDING.

IT IS UNCONSCIONABLE.

TO ME, THIS IS A BLOT ON THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

THEY SAY HOW MUCH THEY ARE FOR THE COMMON PERSON.

THEY WILL ONLY PROVE IT IF THE PAYDAY LENDING BILL CHANGES.

THEY HAVE GOT TO CHANGE IT.

LOU: IT CREATES A NEVER ENDING CYCLE OF DEBT FOR THESE PEOPLE.

IT IS ABUSIVE.

MIKE: THERE IS A BIGGER PROGRESSIVE ELEMENT IN THE HOUSE NOW THAN WHEN I WAS THERE.

I THINK IT WILL GET OUT.

JIM: THAT NEVER HAPPENED.

MIKE: THAT IS THE NUCLEAR OPTION UP THERE TO DO THAT.

JIM: YOU COULD DESTROY YOUR OWN POLITICAL FUTURE IF YOU DO THAT.

MOVING RIGHT ALONG, KATHY GRAY HAD AN INTERESTING STORY ON MONDAY IN THE JOURNAL ABOUT THE RHODE ISLAND ETHICS COMMISSION.

THE HEADLINE WAS, IS IT RIGGED?

THAT IS A TROUBLING HEADLINE, THERE HAVE BEEN ISSUES OVER THE YEARS, AND MORE RECENTLY ABOUT A FIREFIGHTER WHO INTRODUCED A BILL, WANTS TO SIT ON A COMMITTEE ABOUT ALLOWING PTSD FOR FIRE FIGHTERS.

AT FIRST BLUSH HE WOULD THINK THAT IS A CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

THE ETHICS COMMITTEE SAID IT WAS NOT.

TALK ABOUT THE CLASS ACTION.

ARLENE: BRAVO TO CATHERINE -- CATHERINE GRAY FOR EXPOSING THIS.

THIS COMMISSION IS AWASH IN CONFLICTS OF INTERESTS.

THEY ARE MARRIED TO PEOPLE WHERE IT WOULD AFFECT THEIR MONEY, PENSIONS, EVERYTHING ELSE.

HOW CAN PEOPLE WHO ARE THEMSELVES ON THE ETHICS COMMISSION AND CONFLICTED TO START WITH, HOW DO THEY EVER EVEN IDENTIFY A CONFLICT WITH A PARTY THERE WHERE THEY DON'’T EVEN RECOGNIZE THEIR OWN CONFLICT?

IT IS RIGGED, IT IS DISGRACEFUL.

I LIKE JOE SHEKARCHI PERSONALLY, BUT I TAKE IT UP TO THE PEOPLE UP THERE WHO APPOINT THESE PEOPLE AND PUT THEIR NAME ON THE LIST.

IT IS A DISGRACE.

IT IS RIGGED.

WE HAVE STRONG ETHICS LAWS BUT THEY HAVE TOTALLY GUTTED IT WITH THIS GAME THAT THEY ARE PLAYING.

LOU: WHEN YOU CONSIDER THE ETHICS COMMISSION AND THE FACT THAT IT IS RIGGED, THE JUDICIAL NOMINATING COMMISSION IS ALSO RIGGED.

THE GOVERNOR IS ALWAYS MAKING THESE APPOINTMENT TO THE BENCH OR THE COMMISSION.

HE HAS TO PICK FROM LISTS SUPPLIED TO HIM BY THE SENATE PRESIDENT, SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE, MINORITY LEADER.

IN REALITY, IT IS THE ELECTED OFFICIALS WHO ARE FORCE-FEEDING THE GOVERNOR.

IT IS LIKE CHINESE FOOD, A B, C. HE IS NOT MAKING THE PICKS.

MIKE: AS LONG AS WE HAVE A PART-TIME LEGISLATURE, WE ARE GOING TO BE STUCK WITH THIS.

YOU CANNOT EXPECT PEOPLE TO GIVE UP THEIR DAY JOBS AND SERVE IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

JIM: IN THIS CASE WITH REPRESENTATIVE CASEY, AS A REPRESENTATIVE, WOULDN'’T YOU SAY I SHOULDN'’T BE A PART OF THIS?

MIKE: 74 OTHER PEOPLE COULD HAVE BEEN THE BILL IN FOR HIM.

PROBABLY NOT A GOOD LOOK FOR HIM.

I WAS SOMEONE WHO PUSHED THROUGH THE ETHICS REFORM, SO I BELIEVE IN THE ETHICS COMMISSION.

COULD THERE BE REFORMS OR CHANGES IN THE WAY THEY ARE APPOINTED?

PERHAPS.

JIM: THE THING THAT STRUCK ME WAS, AT FIRST BLUSH, THE COMMON SENSE OF THIS SMELLS.

RICHARD LEACH, HE GOT HIT BY A CAR, IS RECOVERING NOW.

BUT HE WAS CHAFEE'’S DIRECTOR OF ADMINISTRATION AND THEY SAID HE WAS NOT IN A POLICYMAKING SITUATION WHICH ALLOWS HIM TO BE A JUDGE.

DOES THAT NOT ERODE THE FAITH OF PEOPLE LOOKING ATTHIS SYSTEM?

ARLENE: THEY HAVE MADE A BAD JOKE.

THEY SHOULD ALL BE REPLACED WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE TRULY INDEPENDENT, WHO HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF ETHICS, BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT ALREADY MARINATED IN THEIR OWN ETHICAL CHALLENGES THEMSELVES.

JIM: WHAT ABOUT THAT WHEN LEACH GOT APPOINTED?

GOOD JUDGE.

LOU: IT IS NOT JUST TO HIM, AND HE IS A GREAT JUDGE.

BUT WE HAVE HAD OTHER JUDICIAL APPOINTMENTS OF PEOPLE COMING OUT OF THE SENATE AND HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

JIM: THE SUPREME COURT NOW.

LOU: IT IS REPUGNANT.

AND BY THE WAY, THEY ARE GOOD APPOINTMENTS, THAT IS NOT THE POINT.

THE ETHICS COMMISSION SAYING THAT IS OK. RUBBERSTAMPING WHATEVER THEY WANT FROM THE GOVERNOR'’S OFFICE.

IT'’S JUST OUT OF CONTROL.

JIM: LET'’S DO OUTRAGES OR KUDOS.

MIKE: I READ IN THE JOURNAL THIS WEEK THAT FOR THE FIRST TIME IN AMERICAN HISTORY, THE ENERGY WE CREATE FROM RENEWABLE SOURCES WAS GREATER THAN THAT WE CREATE FROMCOAL.

WE ARE IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

JIM: DOES JOE MANCHIN KNOW THIS?

MIKE: TORNADOES IN MISSISSIPPI, MARCH, APRIL.

SUPERSTORM BATTERY THE WEST COAST.

I THINK WE ARE WAKING UP TO THE FACT THAT WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT CLIMATE AND THE WAY WE PRODUCE ENERGY IN THIS COUNTRY, OR WE WILL BE UNDERWATER.

JIM: WHAT YOU SEE IN CALIFORNIA IS FRIGHTENING.

AND THEY HAD BEEN IN A DROUGHT.

A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE TO REEVALUATE WHETHER THEY WANT TO LIVE OUT THERE.

ARLENE: DEATH BY GUNS HAS NOW SURPASSED THE LEADING CAUSE OF DEATH AMONG TEENAGERS AND CHILDREN.

THAT IS SUCH A SAD INDICTMENT IN THIS COUNTRY.

HAVE TO STEP UP TO THE PLATE, CERTAINLY THE LOCAL REPUBLICANS, AS WELL.

ASSAULT WEAPONS SHOULD NOT BE IN THE HANDS OF CIVILIANS.

REAL HUNTERS DO NOT NEED ASSAULT WEAPONS WHEN THEY GO AFTER THEIR PREY.

THE GUN VIOLENCE IN THIS COUNTRY IS A DISGRACE, A DISGRACE.

WE HAVE TO CARE MORE ABOUT OUR CHILDREN THAN WE CARE ABOUT OUR GUNS.

JIM: DID YOU SEE THE PROTEST AT THE NATURAL STATE CAPITAL YESTERDAY?

A LOT OF KIDS THERE.

WE HAD AN ASSAULT WEAPONS BAN FROM THE MID-1990'’S UNTIL THE MID TO THOUSANDS, AND THEN IT EXPIRED.

LOU: MAYBE YOU CAN HELP ME UNDERSTAND THIS.

THE DEMOCRATS HAD THE EXECUTIVE BRANCH, THE PRESIDENT, THE HOUSE AND SENATE, WHY DIDN'’T THEY CHANGE IT?

MIKE: FILIBUSTER.

THEY DID NOT HAVE THE 60 VOTES IN THE SENATE.

JIM: THAT WAS IT.

IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE A QUAINT TIME IN THE 1990'’S HOW THEY GOT THAT THROUGH.

YOU WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO DO THAT IN THIS POLARIZED CONGRESS.

LOU: ABOUT A MONTH AGO, WASHINGTON, D.C. CITY COUNCIL WANTED TO REDUCE THEIR CRIMINAL PENALTIES ACROSS THE BOARD, EVEN FOR CARJACKING.

I WANT TO KEEP REMINDING PEOPLE, LAST WEEK, SENATOR RAND PAUL OF KENTUCKY, HIS TOP STAFFER IN BROAD DAYLIGHT WAS STABBED WITH A KNIFE, HIS THROAT AND HEAD.

THANK GOD THE CONGRESS HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO THAT, OVERRULING THE CITY COUNCIL.

IT WAS BIPARTISAN.

WHAT I SAW YESTERDAY IN THE STATISTIC -- BECAUSE I WAS REALLY LOOKING AT IT THROUGH A MICROSCOPE.

67% OF THE CRIMES CHARGED IN WASHINGTON, D.C. DO NOT GET PROSECUTED.

LET THEM ROLL AROUND YOUR BRAIN.

BECAUSE THERE IS A PROGRESSIVE U.S. ATTORNEY.

67%.

JIM: I WAS NOT FOLLOWING THAT A LOT, AND THEN I THOUGHT IF THE REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS ARE AGREEING ON SOMETHING -- LOU: BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE THEY WORK AND LIVE.

THAT IS THE ONLY REASON IT WAS BIPARTISAN.

JIM: THAT IS ALL THE TIME WE HAVE.

KEEP US POSTED.

IF YOU DON'’T CATCH US ON FRIDAY OR SUNDAY AT NOON, WE ARE ALL OVER SOCIAL MEDIA.

WE ALSO ARCHIVED ALL OF OUR SHOWS ONLINE AND WHEREVER YOU GET YOUR FAVORITE PODCASTS.

IF YOU WANT TO TAKE US ALONG FOR A WALK OR IN THE CAR, JUST DOWN THE ONE GET YOUR PODCASTS.

COME BACK NEXT WEEK.

WE NEVER KNOW WHO WILL BE ANNOUNCING FOR CD1, ALL OF THE HAPPENINGS AT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

COME BACK AS "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" CONTINUES.

[CLOSED CAPTIONING HAS BEEN PROVIDED BY CARDI'S FURNITURE AND MATTRESSES] [CAPTIONING PERFORMED BY THE NATIONAL CAPTIONING INSTITUTE, WHICH IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ITS CAPTION CONTENT AND ACCURACY.

VISIT NCICAP.ORG] >> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> FOR OVER 30 YEARS, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF THE POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I'’A